Now reading...

[Persephone]

What is it about?  I know that I seem stupid for this question but I never was too much into Eco...

[Aluqak]

What is it about?

It's about killing monks and reading forbidden books

[Nighthawk]

It's about killing monks and reading forbidden books

Ah yes, Tuesdays

[Monade]

Oh Kris you brought me back to reality
I was surprised by previous post.  
I think The name of the Rose must be more popular in Europe than in Asia. But I didn't imagine many of you do have read it! It is fascinating, however it's such a thick book
Kris, the story in The name of the Rose is mainly about several bizarre deaths in an Italian abbey in 1327,  interspersed with affairs about religious debates in real history. Ooops my synopsis sucks  But it is a great book. I think this book is a summit of both detective story (well, as Eco said it's a detective story, which does seem to be in a detective story form) and historical story (no doubt ). Eco is so good at middle age's subject and cheating
In Eco's Baudolino, even he declaimed at first that he's a liar, I wondered all throughout the book that where the lies began and where the lies ended.(In this way, a little like Lolita ) Inconceivable writer.

Congratulations! I still can't believe that you are such an expert of European culture. I know much less about Chinese one.

Well, The name of the rose is a very hard reading, I guess in every language, because Eco has used so many old languages and concepts. Orlando is the same difficult, and as I understand, you are reading some kind of academical literature? Wow wow wow...

Wow the word expert just frighten me  
I learnt a little about European culture from some books in interest   a bit of academical literature I think, far from enough

Thank you. I am flattered.

[Monade]

I read The Name of the Rose, and I really enjoyed it. I think the difficult part is not the meaning, but to be able to read all the longs discussions of the characters. But, as I liked the subject of these discussions, it was not hard for me to read it 

I only saw the movie but I like it. In my carreer we read a lot of stuff of Umberto Eco but the themes about Theories of Communication.

Wow! Theories of Communication I am still waiting for better version of Eco's book in academic theme. The existing Chinese version is horrible

Hey Markus,
      I have sooooooooooo much to say about translating
      It's saying that poem is what lost in translation. So is literature. Maybe whole thought get lost more or less in expressing and translating.
      Poetry translation is a big subject. In China there always several versions of the classics, and a lot of versions of famous poet's poetry. I mean, each publisher may have its own Chinese version of Dante,Yeats, Baudelaire and so on. But the Chinese translations' quality doesn't promise well nowaday. Compare several translations is very important and needed. Or you may find the poet you fall in love with one version   seems totally unbearable in other version .
      As you mentioned German, I recall that when I selected a course about Kant's Kritik der praktischen Vernunft, the Chinese version I choosed drove me crazy At that time I just thought, between the translator and I, there must be one whose Chinese failed! Kant's thought and sentences is difficult, and that translator make it worse. It relieved when I turned into other version.
      I think in some extent, to translate philosophy ideas between languages both hurt the language and the philosophy   
      And poetry is something mixed literature and philosophy, and in some places beyond them. So poetry translation is something I think incredible and fascinating
 

[Persephone]

Sounds interesting, thank You Monade!

[Monade]

Sounds interesting, thank You Monade!

my pleasure

What is it about?

It's about killing monks and reading forbidden books

After I finishing my post I found Aluqak had given a more pertinent brief introduction already How can I neglected the forbidden books!

[Mystique]

An article on Croatian grammars in 18th century.
Interesting, but I don't feel like doing this atm 

[Lasse]

In China there always several versions of the classics, and a lot of versions of famous poet's poetry. I mean, each publisher may have its own Chinese version of Dante,Yeats, Baudelaire and so on. But the Chinese translations' quality doesn't promise well nowaday. Compare several translations is very important and needed. 

This all sounds very interesting, in my country there is usually just one translation that's "accepted" by the broader public and publishers. At many times these are very old translations, they are trying to "retranslate" them from time to time, but they are really difficult to find. I guess it's also different in China because it's such a big country, I don't even know what dialect is "official" from the many spoken ones, how do books get published?

[Monade]

In China there always several versions of the classics, and a lot of versions of famous poet's poetry. I mean, each publisher may have its own Chinese version of Dante,Yeats, Baudelaire and so on. But the Chinese translations' quality doesn't promise well nowaday. Compare several translations is very important and needed. 

This all sounds very interesting, in my country there is usually just one translation that's "accepted" by the broader public and publishers. At many times these are very old translations, they are trying to "retranslate" them from time to time, but they are really difficult to find. I guess it's also different in China because it's such a big country, I don't even know what dialect is "official" from the many spoken ones, how do books get published?

Before Universal Copyright Convention became legally effective there were many old translations They still can be find in old book shops, and many of them have been put into electronic libraries
At that time there were some classical Chinese versions (a kind of literary language used in China for old time)as well. Even there are many dialects in spoken languages, the written languages are relatively fewer.
The Chinese Mandarin is official Chinese language, when other languages of Chinese minority nationality are also put into publish
After China joined Universal Copyright Convention there was only one new version at most in term of protection for copyrighted works. Always, those exceed protection for copyrighted works are not in this restrain



@Topic
Jorge Luis Borges: Conversations
Review his other works when reading this book
and I am still searching for other versions of Orlando furioso

[Persephone]

Monade, I have one personal question for You about the Chinese literature...

Have You ever read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_of_the_Red_Chamber

I tried to many years ago, when I was about 14 or 13 years old but I definitely didn't get it and stopped after about 50 pages.

[Monade]

Monade, I have one personal question for You about the Chinese literature...

Have You ever read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dream_of_the_Red_Chamber

I tried to many years ago, when I was about 14 or 13 years old but I definitely didn't get it and stopped after about 50 pages.

OH YES！It's the masterpiece of Chinese literature. I think I screw up my courage to read it in the same age
Which version did you read? I think to translate it is a hard issue. Compared with the other 3 in the Four Great Classical Novels in China, Dream of the Red Chamber has much higher literary value. The poems in it are hard to translate. And the sounds, even the parts of Chinese character in the characters' name have meaning and their fate suggestions in it. If I said translation is a difficult thing, to translate Dream of the Red Chamber is nearly impossible At least this work won't be easier than to translate Ulises in other language. 
So that's ok of you to didn't get it in such a young age. Many people major in Chinese literature I knew has working on it for life long time. 
There are many versions of Dream of the Red Chamber with annotations be publish every year. Maybe you already knew there is studies of it,  probably called Red-ology in English. A complicated book, absolutely wonderful.
I suggest you already know about the whole story If you still have interesting in it and want to have a transition to get in it, I recommend this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moment_in_Peking
Lin yutang's novel Moment in Peking.
At that time, many Chinese auther's English was as good as- if not better than- their mother tongue. He was one of them. He treasured Dream of the Red Chamber a lot that he wanted to translate it to make the world enjoy it. He ending up with Moment in Peking, which has similar infrastructure and narrative rhythm. That was originated written in English, which he tried he best to imitate Dream of the Red Chamber's feeling. He just couldn't put it in other language.

I'm glad to introduce these thing to you

[Persephone]

Oh, thanks a lot Well I think I will have to try to read it again.

We have only one translation to Czech language - and that's already quite old but this is not a kind of literature here that would be translated more times in one century I'm afraid.   

The books look like this:


I'll look for it with my next visit in the municipal library

[Persephone]

Oh, and thanks a lot for the suggestion too! 

[Monade]

That's my pleasure
I have to say the Czech version is nicely designed! I'm not sure where they chose these title pictures from, but these suited every parts perfectly

Thank you for showing these.
Moment in Peking is a historical novel covered turbulent events in China from 1900 to 1938 , while Dream of the Red Chamber was written in the middle of the 18th century during the Qing Dynasty. They are different in age and content, but spirit is alike
 Enjoy

[Persephone]

I'll tell You when I finish them! (I mean, finish the reading of them  )

[Lucy]

Moment in Peking is a historical novel covered turbulent events in China from 1900 to 1938

I HAVE read it at least 5 times, and I ADORE it. I didn't know about the story of the novel.

[Monade]

I'll tell You when I finish them! (I mean, finish the reading of them  )

I'd love to

Moment in Peking is a historical novel covered turbulent events in China from 1900 to 1938

I HAVE read it at least 5 times, and I ADORE it. I didn't know about the story of the novel.

WOW！at least 5 times!

Yes, Moment in Peking is no doubt a historical novel. In this way it was different from Dream of the Red Chamber. In Dream of the Red Chamber, that when these stories took place isn't a such important affair.

In my memory, Lin yutang wrote something about that on the preface of original version. I found it out from the internet:
"
     TO THE BRAVE SOLDIERS OF CHINA WHO ARE LAYING DOWN THEIR LIVES THAT OUR CHILDREN AND GRANDCHILDREN SHALL BE FREE MEN AND WOMEN THIS VOLUME WRITTEN BETWEEN AUGUST 1938 AND AUGUST 1939 IS HUMBLY DEDICATED.
"
The early twentieth century of China is such chaotic years. Writing that done as a classic background novel is a great job.

Having read it for 5 times!  WOW you must be very familiar with the modern history of China.

[Lucy]

Actually, my grandma had it on the bookshelf among her books. This is one of the books I've re-read many times. Hm...Goes and takes the book in hand yet from her own bookshelf

[Persephone]

Nor reading this: